Racism isn't just "a card" some people "play"

[bcholmes]

Blaming people of color for Prop. 8 passing in California is racist. So cut it the fuck out. Ditto for veiling your racism with "this is because of turnout for Obama" or "you know how conservative those immigrants can be."

sparkymonster states one of those things that I wanted to believe was obvious, but which apparently is not.

Edit: Here's another good response to the "let's blame the brown people" phenomenon.

Edit the second: Here's a statistical analysis of a white election.

Edit the third: Daily Kos has a good analysis, too!

Comments

[elphie.livejournal.com]

I disagree. 95% of African-Americans in California voted for Obama, and 70%ish of them voted for Prop 8. That means the majority of African-American voters in California simultaneously voted for Prop 8 and Obama. Yes, it makes me angry to see people on one hand casting a vote for one of the greatest advances in civil rights in America, and then with other hand casting a vote to deny another group the right to marry someone they love.

I certainly think it is inappropriate to blame individuals for the actions of the majority of their demographic group. I am equally angry at white voters who voted for Obama and Prop 8, and I know several African-Americans who voted against Prop 8. However, when we rise to the community level and think about who we form alliances with I think the queer community should think twice about allying with the African-American community on a macro level.

[supergee.livejournal.com]

There are plenty of stupid white people to blame. They are no better than We are, for most values of They and We.

[cigfran-lwyd.livejournal.com]

disagree a bit with the tone/trend.

one of the points regularly brought up in relevant training sessions here in DC is that the black community is culturally pretty damn difficult to crack when it comes to queer rights, and that is borne out by the exit polling. while the fact that the actual percentage of black people in CA is 6.5% does mean that it is not to "blame" them for the failure, they are clearly a contributing factor in what was lost by a very close margin. recognizing the effects of racial demographics on actual outcomes is not "racist."

[xthlcm.livejournal.com]

So wait, race had nothing to do with Prop 8 passing, but then everyone in that post complains that we should have done more outreach to racial minorities?

sparkymonster's map is pointless because we're not talking about county-level correlations, we're talking about ethnic ones. The stats given on the percentages of African- and Hispanic-Americans among California's population are important, but also not terribly relevant, because they don't reflect the actual voter turnout on Tuesday. Given the margin by which Prop 8 passed and the overwhelming ratios of support among Latinos and blacks, it's almost certain that Prop 8 passed due to those differentials.

From the NYTimes: (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/06/us/politics/06marriage.html?scp=2&sq=Proposition%208&st=cse)

Frank Schubert, the campaign manager for Protect Marriage, the leading group behind Proposition 8, agreed that minority votes had put the measure over the top, saying that a strategy of working with conservative black pastors and community leaders had paid off.

“It’s a big reason why we won, no doubt about it,” he said.

I know talking about race gives liberals palpitations, but the fact is that this is a racial problem -- racial in that icky Deep Southern way that Californians like to pretend doesn't exist in their state. Maybe it sounds better if I say that Prop 8 passed due to a complex of cultural and social structures in play that are strongly correlated with both ethnic background and homophobic attitudes.

Unless we're willing to directly tackle race in a way that is simultaneously realistic and respectful (I'm thinking about the Obama campaign's targeted outreach programs that focused on issues and arguments that were of import to specific racial groups), we're never going to get past that brown, socially conservative roadblock. sparkymonster's awkward scolding is exactly the sort of liberal head-in-the-sand attitude towards race that caused us to lose.

[redbird]

I also note that this is a convenient way of ignoring the white people who organized and mostly led the anti-marriage forces. It wasn't black churches that wrote Proposition 8, and it wasn't black Obama supporters who put it on the ballot and wrote those dishonest ads. It was middle- and upper-class straight white people.

I suspect that most of the white gay and bisexual people who are blaming black voters right now are more likely to be sitting down at a family dinner with middle-class, straight white bigots than with black heterosexuals, and sitting down to dinner together will be easier if they can ignore the idea that their relatives are part of why this thing passed.

[firecat]

Thanks for hosting this conversation.

I think that blaming any particular group of people for passing Prop 8 is misguided, and blaming people of color is misguided in a particularly distressing way.

I have been around the California initiative process for over a decade now. Time and again I've seen propositions with millions of dollars behind them be defeated, and I'm convinced that a lot of people actually use their own minds and beliefs to choose how to vote.

People believe that same-sex marriage will harm them and their children. Why? We need to convince them otherwise. That will be hard work but I believe it can be done.

[laura-seabrook.livejournal.com]

Well here in Australia we still have in place the "reaffirming" by the previous government that clearly states that "Marriage is a union between a man and a woman". never mind that they don't define either term. There were attempts at civil unions in the A.C.T. but I think that got overturned.

The thing that got me was that we had NO referendum on the issue, either State wide or Federally.

[cigfran-lwyd.livejournal.com]

on your second stats link:

playing fantasy football doesn't really show anything.
the fact that white voters turned out in droves to vote against affirmative action is atrocious and racist. the fact that white people turned out in droves to vote reinforce homophobia is vile.

the fact (acknowledged by that entry) that 70% of blacks in CA voted for Prop 8 is a separate observation. "blaming" that vote for the passage of Prop 8 is racist... ok, i'll grant that. but deflecting the entire question of "why did a group that voted overwhelmingly for obama, a supposedly transformational candidate whose ascendance is the realization of decades of civil rights struggle also vote (less overwhelmingly) against the civil rights of queers" with the idea that even raising the issue is wholly racist, is as pointless as the blame itself.

[cigfran-lwyd.livejournal.com]

i think this is an excellent treatment:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/11/7/34645/1235/704/656272